@small still poor punter,

If you want to visit BNG only to have coffee with me, then you can cancel that idea. Anyway, if you are visiting for some specific purpose, (business or family function) then no problem.

I have visited Mysore too many times. Only train journey. Around 3 hours for onward and another 3 hrs for return. Bus journey may be quicker. But train more comfortable. You will get good sleep.

But there was a time. Punters use to travel from BNG to Madras. May be 4 decades back.

Now coming back to my pet subject:

What is this 5k limit that you are talking about? I have seen a single bet of 3 lakhs in a race at tote. I have seen 1 lakh bet at tote several times. (too many times). Those are the times when bookies were also there. Of course with Mysore option being exercised by many bookie loyalists, such type of dashing, dare devil punters are conspicuous by their absence. On 31st I was witness to a punter betting 10k/5k/35k w/s/p on Saudagar. The horse finished nowhere, but his ticket must have reached dust bin. So, even today 5k,10k,20k bettors are in good number at BNG.

I have traveled by road form Chennai to BNG in the 9os it took 5.5 hours i do not know hw much time in present day scene.

Mys same story 2 hours going 2 hours ccming 5 hours at the race course makes it 9 hoursplus, Certainly if you are young but not at my age now.

Thank you Mr Raghavan for throwing so much light on "Tote vs. Bookie" issue. I understand that for limited bettors (say up to 5k) tote is a safe place.

Hi Stop Fooling Punter : Even if you can make a thousand rupees profit a day after all your expenses, what is wrong in travelling two hours up and down? There are people who travel from Pune to Mumbai and Haryana to Delhi for their livelihood. Similarly, for those who are really serious with racing, travelling a couple of hours should not be a problem. Hope you agree with me. There were days when I used to travel from Chennai to Bangaluru during 90's because I found the environment totally different at Bge compared to what it was in Chennai.

@sspp,

July 12 2010. BNG derby winner Aboline. Not Jacqueline. It seems you are yet to recall the race/horse name. Leave it. There are many people who can not remember their bets of the previous day.

So you were betting high during those days. O K. After seeing your latest post, I can only repeat what I have said earlier. You were not destined to get anything more on that day.

Hi GBR/Raghavan,
In my earlier post, please read it as '20k" (my investment) and not (2k) as rendered earlier. Also, out of 100k (i.e., one lakh rupee), what I was left with when the Derby race started was this 20k. Sorry for the typing error.

Hi Mr Raghavan,

Thanks for joining me on GBR's poser. As I age up, my memory keeps fooling me. (By the way, today is April 1?) If my memory serves me right, that was a Derby race won by Jacqueline where the Vijay Mallya horse finished third in a photo-finish. In fact, the fourth and fifth places were also taken by the same stable. It paid 10/1 and above in bookies (with 100/1 for win). In tote too, it showed Rs.107 before I punched my tickets. I invested my 2k in terms of Rs.200 (20 tkts each). It paid me at the rate of Rs.97/- per ticket.
The main mistake I did was to hand over all the winning tickets at the same counter. In fact, my elder brother was also there with me, and let me tell you he was shell shocked to know that I have won close to two lakh rupees. (I entered the course with 10k and had lost almost 8k before the start of this race).
Maybe it was my bad luck because the woman at the ticket counter downed the window shutters and went into the office room to collect the payment. By the time she came out, it was time for the last race and I could not even study the fluctuations in odds. However, I had two 'bankers' (it's altogether another story that we have 'bankers' in almost every race and feel only when it wins and we don't play it) after the Derby race but just could not do anything.
While I fully agree with you that we will reach only what we are destined for, when it comes to racing I think we have to be really agile to move around, recast our bet and finally call it right before handing over the money at the counter. Having said that, I did not have any regrets that I missed out on those two bets later because there have been days where I have missed a carried over JP, only because I could not make it to the course due to pre-occupation.
I take this opportunity to also share with you and others that when my father was in his death-bed at Apollo in Chennai in 1990s, I had once rolled just 1k on three bets on two consecutive days only on Aslam Khader mounts and managed to clear the hospital bill that went past 65k during those days. While I don't bet these days (for about 4 years now), I don't know if I can be as successful as I was during the late 80s and 90s.
(Mr Raghavan, I enjoy reading each and every post of yours and if when I happen to visit Bangaluru next time I will try to make my way to the racecourse to shake hands with you over a cup of tea. You look a thorough gentleman through your presentations).

@sspp,

Regarding your preference to bet with bookie rather than tote:

Not only you. Except for MYS/BNG punters & to some extent HYD punters, for the rest the tote is not at all an option. But as far as BNG is concerned, in dividend payment, it has beaten bookies fair & square the bookies odds too many times.

So, at centers other than BNG/MYS/HYD it is bookies and bookies kingdom only.

Now I will try to be as reasonable or as blunt regarding my views on tote at bng/mys. A good number of big bettors do consider that as status symbol to bet at tote. No one is asking them to bet at tote and take a lower returns. But, why they are not moving towards tote even as experimental measure is something beyond my understanding. If they are betting 25k with bookies, they can as well try 2k at least at tote. To get first hand knowledge of which one is better. If they view tote with the rotten chashma provided to them free of cost by the bookies, then they will see only the negatives.

However, for them the option is limited. A no bookie environment. I am hearing that bookies still running the business at their home, office etc. That is their pleasure. All big bettors do not know about this arrangement. They have to bet at tote only.

2. Illegal bookies: You say when they are doing the business so openly how one can say that is illegal?

For that question I have no answer. Angered by my repeated criticism of 10% tax bet, several ht members have learnt that I can not answer this one question.

BUT, the society has its own methods of checks and balances. They were the proud owners of huge cash pile. But, PM administered a resounding kick on their backside by declaring that currency as invalid. I sympathise with everyone for their inconvenience. But quite happy with what Government has done. Ask them where that accumulated cash pile for around 10 years. You will get answers like fire, Ganga-jamuna-kaveri.

Threshold for tds is 10k. I think it will be another 7-8 years before the limit increasing to 20k. But, punters do not have serious head ache on this ground. Those betting 15k to 100k should first understand that they have not jumped on to this planet straight from heavens and they are also humans only like those who bet 100s or 500s. They have to put up with such minor irritants. If they are men with very high level of superiority complex, they definitely have the option to travel to MYS/HYD etc.

sspp, The counter clerks expect tips from every winner. O K. They are not supposed to. However they can not demand. If you create a scene, they will just surrender. But, this is not a big issue. Personally, I think you will not be impoverished if you part with 10/- or 20/-. And even 500/- if the win amount is around 2 lakhs. Not compulsory. This suggestion from my side is not binding on anyone.

So, the only serious complaint about tote is the delayed payment which blocked your further bets of the day. Right. Really pitiable. But, finding it hard to believe that the clerk took 45 minutes. THERE IS NO REMEDY FOR ACT OF GOD.

Not only you. I have also experienced such stalemate. On Feb 18th. Was standing in the queue with the idea of betting win/shp (1600/400). In fact, I was the 2nd man in the queue. And was in the queue immediately after the white cone. Had to collect around 2800 on the win ticket. But, there was some server problem. When there was no signs of solution, I dropped the idea of cashing the ticket. Instead kept ready 2000 cash. But, that also did not help. The problem not solved even after 30-40 minutes. Race was over at Mumbai.

And I thanked God. My bet would have been on fav. A 30/1 shot won. My fancy not even 4th. A virtual 2000 bonus to me. AND NOT ONLY TO ME. ENTIRE PUNTING FRIENDS IN THE RACE COURSE! 90% of them would have backed fav. A virtual bonus to all. Computer problem sorted out about 15 minutes before the start of next race and betting resumed.

It is not easy to travel up and down it means 2 hours each way to the race course and back.

I do not want to give you the solution ,it is there for you to see..

Thanks Raghavan for your good inputs and I will choose Mysore option on weekend days.
@SSPP: I fully endorse your comments and I felt the same way lot many times while playing with big bets.

@small-still-poor-punter,

Can you please give some additional data? You punched 20k on an outsider that paid 97. But was left with very little amount to bet in subsequent races.

Can you just strain your memory and tell the center, year & horse name? At least horse name.

Even after your 20k bet also, if the place payout is 97, then that must be Bangalore tote. Please confirm.

Regarding your missed opportunity to bet in the next 2 races since the tote clerk took 45 minutes to pay you, I agree it is a real pity.

There is one thing sspp: Thallezhuthu! You will not get even one paisa more than what the God has sanctioned to you for that day.

Anyway, from my side, I have never experienced so much delay in collecting the payment.

So, can you say the break up of tickets that you had purchased? Was it 50 tkts 40 times or 20 tickets 50 times?

45 minutes delay after declaration of dividends is really the rank inefficiency of the clerk. But, I prefer to fault the system instead of the clerk.

Having said this much, I want to know one thing. When you are well aware that your next bet depends on encashing the win ticket, was there any delay on your part before you started moving towards the tote? Whenever I am in that tricky situation, I will postpone any idea of coffee, snacks etc and position myself in front a vacant tote.

The system is like that. You have to give margin for all such contingencies. As of now, at BNG there are no bookies. So, good or bad, you have no other option. But, I think the frustration that you experienced was during bookie's zamana only. What was the odds given for place by the bookies for the horse that paid 97/- at the tote?

kol:1-3, 2-2days best, 3-7each way, 4-2, 5-5win, 6-2win, 7-1win, 8-3win                       delhi race no2:9win conform

Hi GBR,

I totally subscribe to what Mr Raghavan has advocated. It's always safe to bet with bookies (how can we still call it 'illegal' when it continues to happen in the open?).
From my experience, let me tell you that Tote is for those who play a very limited amount. It's also for those who try SHP, Tanala, Forecast, Quinella, Treble and Jackpot. If you want to play a bigger amount (say anything beyond 5k) it's always wise to knock at the bookies.
There are many reasons for this. First of all, an amount of 5k on an outsider is a dangerous attempt to make because you take a lot of time dividing the tickets that you punch. And when it comes to collecting your payment from those "give me something" windows, it's going to be time for the next race. It means you always run the risk of missing a race after you win a race. I don't think we are in the racecourse to miss (you can 'win' or 'lose' that's different).
I remember once playing a Vijay Mallya-owned horse (ridden by Neeraj Rawal) for a place in Tote. The screen showed Rs.107 for a tenner. I punched 20k after splitting the amount to avoid tax. The horse readily came third (by a SHD) and I had to spend 45 minutes at the counter to collect the winning amount, which was close to Rs.2 lakhs. (It finally paid Rs.97 for place). My next two races were bankers and I had not more than 1k to role it and I stood to lose another few lakh rupees because of the delay in payment.
What I mean to say is with bookies you don't come across such hassles and you know well in hand what is your payment and how soon you are going to get it.
Look my dear, in racing even a small distraction can cost you dearly and why to invite by visiting the tote. I fully endorse the opinion of Mr. Raghavan that you must make it to Mysuru to enjoy your racing, particularly if you are going to bet in a big way.

@GRB,

The royal approach shall be to put up with some strain & loss of time. What I mean is you can travel to & fro Mysore on a daily basis. Train charges very cheap.

If that is not possible, then visit the race course at BNG, start a conversation with whoever you may feel have the answer.

Perhaps you may not get right answer in your 5-6 attempts. But, you will get a proper lead in quick time. Enjoy your betting. Since the said bookies have no overheads like stall fees, hafta to race course vigilance team etc, the betting commission may be zero.

Now, just I am curious. Can you list about 10/12 bets from your side during last 140 days that disappointed you so much that you are ready to abandon the tote outright and bet with bookies even when you know it is illegal.

It is your money & your decision. But, it is always better to exercise the option after some meaningful home work. Not, by generalising some instances of low payouts at the tote. The meaningful home work means, keeping a proper record of all your bets at the tote, (for at least one month), getting the correct average odds the bookies have quoted from centers like HYD or MUM or KOL and then satisfying yourself as to which one is the better option.

I repeat, choosing the royal option (Mysore) is the best approach.