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Will Ex-jockeys Tell Us About 'winning' & 'losing'

By Smart-still-poor-punter | 23-Aug-2017
Hi,

I want to address this post mainly to ex-jockeys, who have ridden a reasonable number of horses during their career and know all the intricacies involved in the trade. (HTians can also join in the discussion). The intention behind inviting ex-riders is that those in the business now may find it quite embarrassing to talk on such a sensitive issue.

A few punters here have been advocating senior jockeys not to accept 'losing' mounts as they have already earned a lot of money and, therefore, hereafter should not ride for the sake of money. My straight question is : 'Is there anything called winning or losing mounts unless and until a race is run?"

As far as I understood racing during my about 25-year punting career (which ended in 2014), a rider accepts any number of rides in any center. In case if he does duty for a particular stable, still he can take permission to ride for others. This is what I had seen with all seniors, starting from Aslam Khader, Pesi Shroff, Vasant Shinde and Sinclair Marshall to the present-day heroes like Sandesh, Trevor, Neeraj, Imran Khan and Chouhan.

Now, you jockeys will have to tell us if you accept a mount after analysing the winnability factor? Is your job not to ride as per the instructions of your stable, although you tend to share your views on the horse's performance? If you're going to decide whether your horse is going to win or not, then why other jockeys should ride in that race at all?

One thing is correct : Jockeys can decide a 'losing' mount, as and when they receive directions from their connections to have an 'off' day. Right? Otherwise, in a field of 8 or 10 horses, how can a jockey claim that he is riding a 'winning' mount? After all, all the jockeys in a race ride only to win, and that's why sometimes we see outsiders upsetting all calculations. Isn't it?

There are requests pouring through this forum to P Trevor not to accept 'losing' mounts. Mr Trevor, how can you answer to this unique question? If only you concede to this request, every punter will feel rejuvenated because they now know that every ride that you accept is going to be a winning one? Is it practically possible?

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13 Replies

Ayyarnet said ...

25-Aug-2017

Confused P :

Thanks a lot for your tip telling Trevor Record. We made little money in mysore race out of your tip only NOT BELIEVING any Race analysis.

Thanks once again.

Three Cheers to Trevor

ayyarnet

Aj37 said ...

25-Aug-2017
Why should any jockey let go of a ride whether it has a fair chance or not ?

If I were a jockey and knowing that my career span is but 15-20 years at best - that too provided I maintain my weight AND stay away from serious injury OR death OR SUSPENSION, I would accept as many rides as my personal fitness permits.

The 'POPULAR' jockeys (refrained from using the word 'BEST') actually don't have much choice if any of their retainers have a runner in a race. But in other races they get approached with multiple options and they normally opt for the ride which they feel they have the best chance on.

Please understand that some of the POPULAR jockeys take additional money from the lesser stables OR owners just to ride in a race, alongwith AIRFARE.

Please punt within ones ability and affordability to lose.

Shaps said ...

25-Aug-2017
Smart-still -poor punter,


How many present or ex-jockey's have come forward to answer your topic ??????

None. Do not expect these people to give away the crooked connections names or identities.

Today, their is no difference between crooked connections and jockey's. All are sailing in the same boat. All are back of the punter's money. All are becomming rich and richer. Rarely a connection can make huge money in merit racing, as they are making today. All manipulations in one form or another.
Daylight robbery is taking place, and here you find people selecting and giving opinions as if racing is properly held in India today.

Ayyarnet said ...

24-Aug-2017

Chancepedance:

At least they will have temporary joy of winning a race ! Forget about money any way they will lose ultimately in other races !!

ayyarnet

Mad Max said ...

24-Aug-2017
@ Hi Guys

Take time and follow your champion jockey from the paddock itself, till the race starts. Take one jockey per day and follow them till last race. What they are doing when they listen the trainer's instruction, adjusting helmet with left hand, or right hand, gloves in hand or already worn, color of the gloves, holding the style of whip and gloves, standing position, what they are doing after sitting on their mount, leg down or leg up, standing, whip on the left hand or right hand, or under the armpit, touching helmet with left hand or right hand, touching or rubbing nose or eyes, when galloping towards the starting stall note down their hands, legs, head movements, your jockey speaking to other jockeys, your jockey take the horse straight to the starting stalls and reach there first, you note down your findings and follow it on next races. Some jockeys get down from the mount at starting stalls, assemble at starting stalls, start talking with other jockeys, some sitting down on the track, some climbing and sitting inside the stall, start showing the any of the above signals.

Remember, you have no touch with the jockeys, but they are vulnerable to doing this, some time at paddock, some time at grand stand, some time at 400m or at 800m or at starting stall or inside the gate. Follow any particular jockey (leading ones) and use the findings to your advantage while betting. The Cameraman normally knows it, sometime he correctly focus the camera at a particular spot and pick the signals. Use a Binocular that would be better.

Manish said ...

24-Aug-2017
It seems that punters are the most lazy community in the whole world.

The responsibility of finding a winner lies on the person who makes the bet, and the guy wants that Trevor should do that work for him. So that, he goes to rc, bets on trevor horses, make a bounty and then go to sleep.

Please understand that no money is enough, the riding fee is Rs. 2000 I guess, and i am sure, Trevor charges a premium also. everybody wants to make more and more money. Nothing wrong in it, its a human tendency.

So u want him to lose 2000 rs. on each ride and sit idle, when Ambani is willing to sell his phone at 1500. OMG.

Subbu said ...

24-Aug-2017
Never back top two jockeys of any center. You may end up in loosing as there will not be good odds or they may fail on hot fav. Moreover animal is the first choice supported by rider.
I personally feel to back 3rd & 4th ranked jockeys as they will be triers.
Ex. Dasrathsingh in Mumbai

Prasad said ...

24-Aug-2017

Friends,
First let us understand that jockeys are professionals. There duty is to do the job as per instructions given by the trainer. Winning or losing is not jockeys business. If trainer instructs loose and jockey whoever may be if he wins will he get the next mount from the trainer. What is the career span of jockeys. Within that they have to make money to survive for there whole life that too with risk. Once the jockey retire who cares for him. winning, loosing ,gambling is all punters business. If you can read the owner, trainer or jockeys more importantly bookies mind you survive or else you are out. you can pick looser in a day without any information to survive and not a winner with lot of homework. This is what my 50 years experience says.

Chancepedance said ...

23-Aug-2017
Even if Trevor wins he is still hurting his followers as the winnings are cursed and will not stay with them.
So win or lose how does it matter?

Ayyarnet said ...

23-Aug-2017
Confused P :

Thanks for the information. We wish him an early achievement 1000 wins !
Seasoned punters may not bet also even if Trevor rides a horse with no chance of winning. But majority of the public are innocent people and they have regards for him and trust his talents and might bet blindly just because of him and finally lose. Why to hurt his fans ?

with best regards

ayyarnet

Confused P said ...

23-Aug-2017
@ Ayyarnet,

Leaving all things aside,

He may have been keen to complete his 1000 wins before he leaves for Australia. As of End of Calcutta Races today (8/23) he is at 997.

Ayyarnet said ...

23-Aug-2017

Sangitha :

Madam

one small correction in your posting instead of losing mount you have typed winning mount !!!

What we wanted to say is that Trevor as of now is a leading talented jockey. He need not depend on his paltry riding fees for a living. He has sufficient funds with him. Instead of riding Also ran type of Horses he can give the same to fellow jockeys and there by he can maintain his brand image of winning horses with fair chances of winning plus with his talents and ability. We are not asking or demanding it is only a suggestion. He is not bound to accept our views. Aslam Khader champion and exemplarily talented Jockey used to do that. That is all we have absolutely nothing against him. As you say it is his internal affair we have no right to interfere.


Regards

ayyarnet

Sangitha said ...

23-Aug-2017
Hi

how can someone inform jockey trevor or anyone not to accept winning mount, this is a joke as if someone knows about the winning horse then probably he would own world bank.

sangitha